Know Your Money with Bronwyn Waner and Craig Finch
Know Your Money with Bronwyn Waner and Craig Finch
92. Revolutionizing Financial Conversations with Confidence 6 of 7
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Unlock the secrets of effective financial communication and revolutionize your financial planning experience with insights from our latest episode featuring Warren, Craig, Bronwyn, and special guest Rob Mac Donald. Discover how mastering the art of dialogue can transform the way you and your financial planner collaborate, ultimately leading to a more satisfying and successful financial journey. Learn from real-life examples and expert takes on the psychology behind financial interactions, as we draw parallels to Malcolm Gladwell's insights on doctor-patient communication and highlight the profound impact small changes can make.
Join us as we dissect practical strategies for enhancing understanding and trust between clients and financial professionals. We delve into the role of clear, jargon-free language and consistent communication—be it through newsletters or podcasts—in building enduring relationships that withstand the test of time. Hear how one planner's perception of a client's needs shifted dramatically due to an open and honest conversation, underscoring the crucial importance of staying connected as life evolves. This episode is your gateway to navigating long-term financial planning with confidence and clarity.
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Welcome to Know your Money, where we will explore our relationship with money and how the psychology of it impacts our financial decisions, as everyone thinks about money differently. In our podcast, we'll be presenting a variety of financial topics in an easy to understand way, which we hope will assist you with managing your money. Hello everybody, welcome to Know your Money. Warren Craig, how are you today?
Speaker 2:Very well, Bronwyn. How are you? What about me? No, we'll get there. How?
Speaker 1:are you?
Speaker 2:I'm very good. Thank you, craig. How are you, my friend, very good. Thanks, craig. How are you, my friend, very good? Thanks, warren. You, yeah, it's a good day Today's a good day.
Speaker 3:Who's in the studio? You opened the door just now for somebody else. Oh, he's back again.
Speaker 2:He's back.
Speaker 4:Like a bad smell. That won't, rob. How are you, rob? I'm good. Thank you, warren. Yeah, good to be back. Very good to be back and to be collaborating with you again.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I just love what you do because I think it's very thought-provoking and allows you to see more than just the shadows, I guess.
Speaker 4:Well, that's kind of you to say that, because one of I mean you know, warren and Bronwyn, you and I were in a session yesterday. We were talking about the why, why we do stuff and sort of part of my why is I'm very keen to try and help people look at things differently and try, and you know, push sort of just perceived wisdom, you know, and then you know because I think that you know, that's the way we improve what we do, if we can try and think about things differently and that. So thanks for that feedback, pleasure yeah.
Speaker 1:Awesome. What sea are we on today?
Speaker 4:We're on communication, and communication is very interesting because it actually goes to the heart of financial planning and the experience of financial planning. So there's been quite a lot of research done around this, because I think the biggest challenge that I'm sure you, bronwyn and Craig, would acknowledge is that your problem is is that you meet with a client, you have a good planning session, you give them advice and then off they go and one doesn't really know whether the advice was that good or not until five, 10, 15 years, 20 years time. And that's what really makes it hard, you know, because when I go and see my doctor and I've got a bit of a cold and my doctor gives me a couple of tablets and I walk out and two days later I'm better, I know that my doctor had worked and I don't know how you guys experience it from your side about this challenge that you face.
Speaker 4:I mean, how is it for you?
Speaker 3:It's so true, robert, because you might put a plan to say, retirement a plan in place and that's going to be a 30-year plan. So you know it's not so exciting for the client to go oh yippee, you're at 30 years time. You know that's. And then, on the risk side, you protect the client for unforeseen passing away or loss of income protection.
Speaker 3:We've spoken many times and only when that event happens, then you can, they'll truly understand how important that product was or the plan you put in place, and on the one hand, you definitely don't want that to happen to anybody and on the other hand, when it does happen, the family is so grateful that that plan was put in place and both parties the client and you had put that plan in place, but you don't want that ever to happen. If it does happen, then you can see the fruits of your labor, basically. So you know this is it's not like an instant thing. When you go to, as you say, the doctor or the restaurant you buy, buy a great meal and you enjoy it straight away and you say call the chef over and thank him for his meal.
Speaker 1:yeah, it doesn't work like that, yeah, so and I think you have to communicate things that may never happen, which is also a hard thing, like severe illness cover or income protection, but the what if has to be brought in and communicated.
Speaker 4:Yeah, absolutely, and so I think this goes to the core of why communication is so important. So there's research around the world to show that a client's experience of financial planning is not determined, or their satisfaction with it is not determined, by the quality of your advice. Because, as we do, we don't know what the quality sometimes is until we get to that point. The quality, the experience of the quality sometimes is. Until we get to that point, the quality, the experience of the quality of advice is determined by your communication, and so communication is the one most important activity that any financial planning business can do with their clients. But we'll get into it. But communication is a two-way thing as well, so it's not so at the moment. I'm suggesting that, for a client, how you communicate with them and what you communicate about and why you communicate are critically important to their experience of your advice.
Speaker 3:But do you think communication also from the client's perspective to us? So maybe an event changing in their lives and they pick up the phone and say this event's happened, we've had a baby, what about education, or whatever it might be. I think it's important that they are able and comfortable enough to pick up the phone to us and say this is what's changed in my life.
Speaker 4:Let's discuss it. Yeah, absolutely. I think of a story of a financial planner that I do some work with who shared with me that he had been through a very thorough financial planning process with a client a new client come on board, thorough planning, put the plan together. Client then thought, hang on, there's one thing I haven't told you my son is a drug addict and I actually think we need to make a plan for him, you know, because he may not, you know, be able to earn his own income. And, as the financial planner said to me, you know this fundamentally changed the plan. Yeah, for sure. And as the financial planner said to me, you know this fundamentally changed the plan.
Speaker 4:Yeah, for sure, but it relied on, as you say, greg, the client disclosing to the planner fully what's going on in their lives. And so that's why the other Cs are also so important that we've spoken about, because you know you've got more chance of a client disclosing to you if they connect with you and if you know you've tried to encourage them to be curious and they're confident in you and that it's a collaborative, they recognise it as a collaborative process. You know All of those things are important, but I think, in terms of, is your advice good or not? You're a great guy, craig, but can I trust you as a practitioner? Actually, the way you communicate with me is going to determine that, and it's not only the communication, you know, sort of outside of the room, in a sense, between the times we meet, but it's also how we communicate in the meeting as well.
Speaker 4:And I'm sure you've heard that story that Malcolm Gladwell shares in his book Blink his book Blink, where he referenced a woman named Wendy Levinson's research about what distinguishes US doctors who don't get sued versus those who do get sued. Do you know about that research? Yeah, and basically what they found was that the patients who sued their doctors was that the patients who sued their doctors. They basically had less time with the doctor than the patients who didn't sue them, and we're talking about marginal time, so the difference was just over three minutes.
Speaker 4:Sure In other words that was enough for the patient to get a sense that they've been cared for by the doctor in that extra three minutes, and so it was a remarkable sort of piece of research to show that it took three minutes for a patient to feel like this doctor really genuinely is concerned about my well-being versus those who sued. But anyway, that's just one example of how it's not the technical expertise that's the key.
Speaker 2:It's actually that human connection and and the communication that happens around that hi everyone, if you would like to get a copy of rob's book, the seven pillars of financial health, we have shared a link in the bio with the web address as well as a discount code you can use. The book retails for 375 rand excluding delivery and with this promo code you will pay 370, which includes delivery. Alternatively, you can find the book at exclusive books or other bookstores. We would like to thank you for listening and please remember to like, subscribe and share the podcast so that we can bring on more exciting guests like Rob to help you with knowing yourself and knowing your money.
Speaker 3:Also his book that I'm not sure. The other book he wrote Tipping.
Speaker 1:Point maybe.
Speaker 3:Tipping Point. I think it was where one of the airlines they were having quite a lot of accidents and fatalities, yes, and they worked out that the cockpit discussion between the pilot and the co-pilot there's this hierarchy of authority on one of the airlines and they were speaking their own language and often the co-pilot said the mountain's coming, be careful, or we're running out of fuel, and the pilot, he was fatigued and because he was a senior person, he didn't listen to the junior person and all they did was change the the language in the cockpit to english, where they both weren't. Their first language wasn't english, but they didn't refer back to the hierarchy of their tradition and they spoke english to each other and that reduced the fatalities and the accidents. I don't know tremendously because of that.
Speaker 1:So back to communication in a different way, absolutely absolutely key and I think that's also important to speak the language that the client can understand as an advisor, because often we speak jargon and you do.
Speaker 3:Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1:And you don't understand, and you've got to be open enough to be able to say what does that mean? And don't you think?
Speaker 2:No, I do, I do. I also think, if you take it back. I'm sure we've spoken about this before, but communication works. With regards to the way, if I'm panicking and saying I want to go to cash, craig, I want to go to cash, you need to be able to communicate to me and you need to be able to get me to trust you as to why I shouldn't. So. In a heightened moment, communication is probably the most important time in time.
Speaker 4:Yeah, and I think the key to that, warren, is that, ideally, Craig or your financial planner has been communicating with you consistently, so it's not just because the one other mistake that gets made is the communication only happens in times of crisis. Yeah, so actually, I think what is key and it goes back to we've spoken about how you build trust, and one way is through consistency and reliability. Is that okay? You know Craig sends me a newsletter every week or every couple of weeks. How often do you guys send out a newsletter?
Speaker 1:Once a month.
Speaker 4:Once a month.
Speaker 1:Podcast once a week.
Speaker 2:Okay, yeah, so there's a consistent form of communication happening that… and they do, I'll give them that they cover relevant topics that are happening like before the two-pot system came in. I covered that yeah.
Speaker 4:Yeah, yeah. So then that consistent communication gives you a sense, I think, that they know what they're doing and that they are thinking about you as well, and so, therefore, when you are worried that actually you'll listen to them, probably more likely.
Speaker 2:Do you feel that? You know, with financial planning, a lot of it is people want to feel safe for their financial future. You know safety is so important to us all of us or their financial future, you know safety is so important to us all of us and to know that somebody is looking after us is the key thing. So if you're constantly communicating that we are aware of what's going on financially, globally, locally, whether it's through these podcasts or WhatsApp every now and then, or whatever it is, people will. They'll feel safe.
Speaker 3:And that's again, it's the communication, because if you don't do that, then yeah, and from your side as well, as things change in your life where you've got some worries or you've got some future dreams and goals or ideas of changing your life, it's hopefully pick up the phone to us and say this is what I'm thinking about. Yeah, it's important.
Speaker 4:Yeah, absolutely, you know. I mean, I do hear instances where a great plan's been put together and then, you know, a client goes off and drives down to the coast and sees a beautiful plot of land which was never a discussion in the financial plan. And then they come back on Monday and say phone up Bronwyn and say Bronwyn, you know, I won't believe it, I've just found this wonderful plot and it was only 500,000 rams. Sounds like my dad. He didn't actually do it, but that's what he does. So, you know, ideally you want clients to any significant life or money decision. You would like them to be using you as a sounding board. So to your point, craig, it's very much a two-way thing and it's almost like the glue that holds the plan together.
Speaker 4:This ongoing communication Because I always like to say that once a financial plan is written and implemented, it has the risk of changing the next day. Somebody could be retrenched, somebody could die is written and implemented. It has the risk of changing the next day. Yeah, somebody could be retrenched, somebody could die, somebody could get divorced, somebody could have a child, somebody could marry, you know. And so this ongoing communication is so important to it, you know, yeah, and the real challenge we face, or your clients face, is that in the world we live in and you were alluding it to the other day, warren, about cell phones your clients are facing, and we all do face this plethora of information, the garage it doesn't stop, it doesn't stop and can you imagine, also now with like real-time investment information coming in and you know I don't- follow.
Speaker 2:follow business news and I got thinking on my news feed today about Tesla shares falling.
Speaker 3:I don't care.
Speaker 2:Why are you telling me?
Speaker 4:Make you panic, yeah, yeah. And so that I mean it reminds me a bit of that George Bernard Shaw quote about. You know, the thing about communication is the illusion that it's taken place. Yeah, you know, and it's a bit like, because that's not really communication, that's just like information bombardment, sensory, overload, sensory, yeah, exactly. And so how do we counter that?
Speaker 4:Well, I think it sounds like you guys are doing it through consistent, regular communication, reminding your clients that you're there, having podcasts like this where, you know, relevant topics are discussed. And it's not just the hard, what I call the hard stuff, it's not just to go out, because actually, you know, I'm not interested in what the value of Tesla is. You know, I'm more interested to know that I've got a diversified portfolio that, over the next 10, 20 years, is going to deliver the returns that are going to help me retire with enough money. That's what I'm interested in, and that's a complete distraction, you know. But the media are a business of their own, so they want you to be distracted, they want you to act on it, they want you to do something about it. Yeah, so I mean, for me, you know, communication is at the core of building trust with clients and keeping clients on track and helping clients make choices that are not self-sabotaging but are in their best long-term interests.
Speaker 1:For sure, and I think, anyone listening today, if there is something that you feel that you should communicate with us that has changed in your life, please do feel free to reach out. Thanks so much, rob. Thank you, guys. Have a good one.
Speaker 3:Thanks everybody, Bye-bye. Thank you for listening. If you have enjoyed this podcast and would like to subscribe, please visit our website, wwwgrowthfpcoza. The information we have provided in this podcast is our personal opinion. For more detailed information, please discuss your financial situation with a financial planner.